General Chat / "GOP doesn't reflect America"

And why can the same not be said for everybody else? How dare I have an opposing view and voice it.

how dare you decide that you are right, and everyone else is wrong, before they even opened their mouths. Right in one ear... straight out the other I tell ya...

Again, the same claim can be made about you.

actually, I did take into consideration the things you said, and what you said that IS true, i agreed with.

You haven't given me the same courtesy, and you never will, so this conversation is over.

Riiight. So I'm should believe that you gave my posts consideration but you will never believe I think about what everybody else says?

Lazyboy, give it up.
Of course you're right any everyone else is wrong.
What are they thinking?!

So I'm not entitled to my opinion why?

Why do you keep going in circles? You're on the fast-track to nowhere.

Nobody's giving me an answer. Apprently I'm stupid and thick headed for having contrary views. But that really isn't much of an answer.

how dare you decide that you are right, and everyone else is wrong, before they even opened their mouths.  Right in one ear... straight out the other I tell ya...

That didn't work for you?
You just deflected it back at Blitz, which doesn't really help anything.

You people will soon find it useless to argue on the internet over something this stupid.

Also, just because someone doesn't agree with you does not mean that they are wrong. There is a thing called an opinion.

Now if you guys can actually debate without throwing personal insults, then by all means go ahead, but as of now this is fucking stupid.

Oh, yeah, OMG VOTE BUSH LOL

All that has been said is that I should trust them to consider me but I cannot expect that same trust of them. So what's my basis for trust?

umm... we were on the basic arguement. but this never became an explain your reason. we ie, Blitz-Sama, Coaster Ed and I see something seriously flawed in your opinions. Facist mixed with Socialism, Communist = Socialism, government is force, your near anarchy or full anarchy. democracy is terrible. All these are terribley flawed ideas, because here's the thing Coaster Ed, Blitz-sama, and I think of the people around us other then ourselves. We all hold different personal view, Coaster Ed is Existentianal, Blitz-Sama is non religious (i think) and i'm Muslim. I don't accept gays in marriage but by law of a state where church and state are ment to be seperated it ought to be allowed. its not just about myself, its about the people and society around me. You have the freedom of MIND to not like a certain race, BUT when it comes to you in the poisiton of employer or a leader and the group you deslike does not give you the right to infringe your deslike on them. their are flaws, the eqaulity of the sexes will NEVER be fully equal because their will always be Female and Male and different thinking and the sorts, their will always be however equality for ALL or will be in America, does not matter your sex, race, sexual orientation or whatever in the job and in the community of America.

your entitled to an opinion, but we see a flaw and are trying to correct it. you only read the Communist Manifesto which holds very little to what Socialism is today, you read "Know the Enemy" which ofcourse by the title is anti-socialism. but reading one side dosent give you a balance view of this topic. a one sided, a one sided read, or a one sided heard view dosent make it a balanced opinion. There are ALWAYS and i mean ALWAYS a second view of an issue, every controversial issue. hell every issue has two sides. and everything you've said has basically avoiding or twisting your own opinon.

as for the examples you have said

Facist mixed with Socialism, Communist = Socialism, government is force, your near anarchy or full anarchy. democracy is terrible, facist is the same as Socialism. no one should use, their should be no laws.

I didn't bring up Hitler. But he is a National Socialist. When it comes to his beliefs, yes, I trust Hitler.

Mussolini I brought up because he is perfect for linking socialism with totalitarianism. He was a Social Democract. He was much more open minded than Hitler. If I wanted a tyrannical tie he would be my man. And again his words on his beliefs are what I will go with.

I said "near anarchist". The key word being near. The government should be small, limited and out of the private domain of individuals.

Democracy is terrible. It is our society's cancer. It is based soley on the idea of the majority always being right. It creates the idea that people should just go with everybody else. I find this destructive of the individual. Since it cannot accept the individual it cannot accept any sort of minority group. Thus it only fuels mass groups. But everybody has been so well trained in "Democracy is super!" that the idea of another government that enales freedom is dismissed. I believe in a republic. I think there is a serious difference. A republic has individuals lead a group selected by majority. MAjority support is not destroyed, but it is balanced out by being headed by an individual.

I say it right now I am very reluctant to believe anybody who goes around saying how he thinks of others first. I think everybody does things for themselves no matter what. When a person is selfless they tend to feel joy. That joy is desirable and thus done more. A person is motivated to help another because he wants to. It may be ingrained by others but it is still a want. But all in all I don't see how your selflessness is relevant.

Is a privately owned business still a person's private domain? I say yes. As part of one's private domain racism and sexism and all those other -isms are not my business. I never said it was an okay practice for public corporations or government. And all this discrimination has become bad business in the US. An accusation of unfair discrimination has rather dissasterous effects on a business.

I never said I only read Communist Manefesto. I was makign the point that it is all very very very very similar. Ed's main link was to a site listed under "Marx". I don't think that is coincidence.

I am not aware of any book or publication known as Know the Enemy. I searched Barnes & Noble's website and the closest result was a book entitled Know Your Enemies. And unless the computer securities field is a front for anti-socialism the book is irrelevant. I asked if you had heard of "Know thy enemy". It is a military phrase. I'm probably wrong but I believe it comes from The Art of War.

At least we are getting forward in our debate.

My problem with your view of "individual everything" is that sometimes there is a greater, common good, that must be balaced with the rights of an individual.

Much as murder infringes upon ones right to live, I find that outlawing murder also serves the common good.
I also say the same thing about protecting the environment. About having non-discriminatory work laws. While being able to be racist in your workplace could be seen as a private right, it serves the greater good if laws outlaw this sort of discrimination.

Murder is not a compromise. That is the deliberate killing of an innocent. A person cannot claim a right to life and destroy it. That is hypocritical.

Destroying the environment damages the lives of others. Again, it is hypocritical. But I am against stupid "alternatives" such as electric cars that will most loikely get their electricity from fossil fuel burning generators.

Again, nobody is looking at what I am saying. PRIVATE BUSINESSES have a right to discriminate for any reason. The Girl Scouts don't let boys join. The Boy Scouts don't allow gay leaders. The KKK is only open to white protestants. Why? Because they are private organizations. Privately owned businesses are private organizations too.

ummm.... i didn't even think we were arguing about the private lives, and besides those are all groups and or clubs for kids and adults. some are open some are not. what is is even the business's (whether you consider private or public) like Microsoft, GM, etc. those cannot descriminate, BECAUSE my friend, people need jobs, GM cannot simply say to blacks or arabs or jews "sorry we don't accept blacks here" thats racisim, you can make a All-White Boy Club. jsut as there are at my school like Society of Black Engineers Club, or MSOE (Milwaukee School of Engineering) Womens Orginization. yet again though, those are all groups and or clubs.

Microsoft and GM are both publically traded companies. I'm really perplexed as to why the difference is so hard to see.

because i don't understand the difference between private business and public business.

private to me is :

mom and pop grocery, family dentist, private clinics (the very small kinds), private golf clubs, and basically all types of clubs. girl scouts/boy scouts.

public to me is :

all major corporations.and all public government or public places ot work at like Stadiums, and Parks.

now.. you have every bit of right to have an anti-feminist club, or a anti-black or whatever anti-group club you want to have it private is cool by me, but when you comment that how do you expect racisim to end if you yourself want the right to continue to spur it? dosent that make it worse? you have i guess, technically every right to make a group or club like that, that IS private but not really a business, atleast not exactly feasible in America anymore.

A private company is any company that doesn't publicly sell stock.

A major corporation can still be privately owned. I'd consider Chick-Fil-A to be a major corporation. Yet the company is still owned by the Cathy family. The Boy Scouts are a huge organization. The Boy Scouts runs camps and stores all over the US. They are all run by paid employees. That sounds like a business to me. If a stadium is owned by a single person it is private property. Gramercy Park in New York is a privatly owned park and access is restricted.