Music Forum / Eminem Not A Lyracist?

I actually quite like Dido.. Shes the only singer of that type i actually like quite a bit. I dont listen to her when either of my parents are around coz they think im gay

i didn't find those lyrics to be particularly moving, or particularly well crafted. if that is a sampling of Eminem's best, then he isn't that amazing. i actually prefer Karen O's lyrics from "Pin"* to "we quick to pull the gat out, and set it, and leave you with more shit missin then a Lil Kim radio edit".

* Karen O is the lead-singer of the "hip" New-York band Yeah Yeah Yeahs, her lyrics typically consisting of growls, moans, hums, and the occasional nonsensical-phrase. a sampling of her lyrics from the song "Pin" are...

"bom-bom-bom-bom-bom-bom-bom-bom, doonum-doonum, doonum-doonum"

...which are only slightly more discernable in their meaning than the Eminem lyric i posted.

chauncey, you are smarter than that.
You should know to familiarize yourself with the language and references used before judging.

Eminem doesn't sing, he raps. I just basically don't have any connection with any of his music, even though I've been through bad times that are mentioned as a subject matter in his "songs" I just find his approach completely different to mine.

This is all coming from someone whose musical taste is best described as indie rock, btw...

Anyway, the topic title is eminem being a lyricist. Stan is a well put together song, but I personally think that he often ruins his lyrics with the odd contrast of a poppy chorus and angry lyrics.

i really don't like rap, but eminem isn't that bad

GRRRRRR @ DJ - Caspers Cha Cha Slide... its seriously a load of bollocks, but a bit hit here in the Uk. Its on all the damn music channels... its not music, its a damn dance

Sorry it came on a few mins ago....

Eminem should've left the game a while ago. i think that he's treading water, whining about this and that and really making a much bigger deal of himself than he should be.
he goes and disrespects fags, gets in the news.
then the incident with his mother, and Kim, and gets on the news again.
then he starts writing songs about being in the headlines every other day, and acting like an anti-messiah for down-and-out suburbanite kids that drive Camaros.
then he begins to express how he's pissed with stardom, how he doesn't like people bothering him and getting into his business and this and that and the other.
and to me it seems rather pointless. sure he's got a catalogue of impressive songs and good punchlines. but the premise behind them all -- be it bitchy, arrogant, aggressive, more bitchy -- are so contradictory to one another that it all becomes a net-like mindfuck that makes me question why he's still around... or maybe he's scraping the bottom of the pot for more reasons to write shit. one case in point: "my band, my band, my band, my band, my baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand."

grrr @ mainstream radio and artists

the more you complain about mainstream radio, and post every hardcore song on your winamp playlist in the "What are You Listening to Right Now?" thread, and run around inserting band names into posts and sigs, the more people are going to hear it, the faster it will become mainstream, the less cause and purpose the scene will have.

"Stan" is a great song. Probably the only one I like by Eminem.
But I occasionally listen to his newer album. Its not too bad.

god, i'm tired of these subculture cretons who treat everything that's mainstream likes it's a disease... and then turn around and listen to some pathetic little xcopy punk band that sounds just like fucking CAROUSEL, or dead fucking kennedys. Both of which are the icons of this lame wannabe-counter-culture of the supposed "*punks". I'm also sick of arguing with punk music fans... its always "the message" this or "the emotion" that, or even "it's about the community!". Well I got news for you. The message is trite, the emotion is unoriginal; a parody of itself even, and every last form of music has a friggin community, so citing that as your plus is just placing your own culture above others, which it isn't. And wasn't the original deal with punk supposed to be counter culture? Pfft.

*note: punks died out when the original movement died out, same goes for hippies. These archtypes don't mean what they used to mean, and only existed in their respective era, much like beatniks and such.














...sorry, just needed to get that out of my system.

I wonder what this thread was inspired by
I think I better reply

I don't think Eminem is a good lyracist. Yes, he does have some word play and some intresting ryhmes, but, everything he said in those lines has been said before. I find it really boring to listen to rap music where the topics are "Murder", "I'm The Better Emcee" and "Money, Cash, Hoes (Drugs)". I could classify any of those lyrics you posted above, into any of these categories:

Cleaning Out My Closet- MURDER
Bad Meets Evil- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
I'm Back- MONEY CASH HOES (DRUGS)
Drug Ballad- MONEY CASH HOES (DRUGS)
Under The Influence- MURDER
Soldier- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
Till I Collapse- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
Till I Collapse- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
Pistol Pistol- MURDER
American Psycho- Somewhat intresting. Upon closer inspection, half the rest of the song features: MURDER/ MONEY CASH HOES (DRUGS)
8 Mile Road- GHETTO (Sub Heading)
Renagades- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
Hellbound- MURDER/ I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
Hellbound- MURDER
Any Man- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
Any Man- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
Any Man- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
Scary Movies- I'M THE BETTER EMCEE
We Shine- MURDER
Dead Wrong- MURDER

PLEASE, was there anything really original in there. That is what every other rapper ever said just said in a slightly different way. Nothing new, nothing intresting and nothing I would spend money on.

"I'm just tired these days, tired of cliches/ Tired of everything, I'm rarely amazed/ Only a few could quench my thirst for inspiration/ Get my hear racing/ And thinking of things that I would not usually think" Kamau

nate, that wasn't the point. The point was that he knows what to do with words, and he does.
Personally, that little "lyric" you quoted isn't as impressive as you think anyway.
Want to be blown away by someone elses deepness and understanding and wisdom? Read a friggin book. Try "The art and zen of motorcycle maintenance". Good read.

In anycase, songs on a persons or societal mentality (that would include motive behind violence, drug use, and ego) can go as deep as you want them to, but they just tend not to go there.

You know what you need nate?
You need haiku.

I think that my dislike for Eminem stems from my dislike for mainstream rap which stems from MTV and other various sources.
I usually am not anti-mainstream or whatever (I can listen to Britney Spears for Christ's sake), but what rap is portraying to the masses is really quite unappealing to me - it's incredibly redundant. If Eminem's lyrics were REALLY brilliant, he wouldn't (and shouldn't) have to rely on these fake and pop-esque songs to sell his records.

But, I'm not really one to talk since I really don't listen to Eminem.
I'm probably making myself seem incredibly ignorant and the like, so I think I'll stop now.

Hahahaha.
Britney Spears isn't redundant! No!

oops, john did it again...

I didn't kill anyone, did I?
Beat.

I digress...
Back on topic...

nate, that wasn't the point.  The point was that he knows what to do with words, and he does.
Personally, that little "lyric" you quoted isn't as impressive as you think anyway.

In anycase, songs on a persons or societal mentality (that would include motive behind violence, drug use, and ego) can go as deep as you want them to, but they just tend not to go there.

You know what you need nate?
You need haiku.

I wasn't trying to "blow you away" with those lines I quoted. The point was that I agree with Kamau, I can relate to his music. Another reason that I dislike Eminem. I know Iris doesn't have cash, probably doesn't have Hoes and probably doesn't do drugs. He probably hasn't murdered anyone and he probably doesn't live in a ghetto. He doesn't rap for a living, so he's not the better emcee either.

And lyrics are ultimatley words that accompany a song. If the concept he is talking about has been said before, they are still the lyrics, and therefore, he is not a very good lyracist.

If you don't want to get sick of music, don't listen to the radio... the last song I was sick of was Drops Of Jupiter.

I'm Rick James, bitch.

I actually quite like Dido.. Shes the only singer of that type i actually like quite a bit. I dont listen to her when either of my parents are around coz they think im gay 

that's not right..

I repeat, iris was not commenting on eminems choice of subject matter, just the rhymes.

What I'm saying is that if you claim subject matter as trumping any other value a song might have, then most novels trump your songs.

And I relate to John Mayer down to a "t", every last song hes sung felt like I would have wrote it. Do I think he's the best lyricist ever because I relate to him the most? No, hes good, but he ain't great. The personal impact a song has on someone does not enter into my calculations when dealing with raw talent or skill.

Eminem... the best rapper? You've got to be fucking kiddin' me right? What is this world comming to?