H2H8 / H2H8 General Thread

The reason I responded the way I did was because of two things.

1. Its been almost a year since the contest, there is nothing to be done about it, we tried our best to make the contest fair but obviously it's impossible to do so. We all worked hard to make the contest possible and seeing people bitch about it still for days on end, especially when it's stuff we cannot control is annoying and frustrating. Especially, like I said, considering the time that has passed. If it was two weeks later, sure I'd understand, but it's been damn near 12 months and considering that people should be able to get over what happened knowing that nothing can be done to change it.

2. Kind of elaborating on the first point but, I'm just sick of all the complaining and bitching that happens on the site with regards to how things were run or handled. It's no fun to come on here or discord and just see people complaining. The admins (not including me), and our referees all do/did a good job to try to make this site work and put a lot of honest time and effort into it. Especially when it comes to a contest like this where they're all both trying to run the contest and manage a team on top of that. Sure it's not perfect, but it's a fucking fan site for a 20 year old game. It's not mean to be taken so seriously that people get so upset about things that happened years in the past.

It's a game, it should be fun, we're sorry that we couldn't stop people from skirting the rules but there are some things that are just out of our control. We'll try to do better next time, if their is one, but the contest should be fun first and foremost so giving teams the freedom to not be constantly monitored, audited and investigated by 3rd parties is probably something we want to keep.

Ultimately a 6% share on a park isn't going to make that much of a difference. We're sorry it happened, but we need to get over this silly stuff. Most of us are in our 20s and 30s now. We all probably have better things to do than worry about stupid little RCT contests that happened in the past.

Just want to say I love all of you guys and am thankful for the admin team and community.

 

Shame that people cheated, but it is what it is at this point. Hope that we can all move forward from it and keep pushing this game to evolve and grow - simply because it's fun and it's something we all enjoy.

 

G, i had a lot of fun in H2H with you as a captain and I'm grateful for the experience.

 

But with all that said, can we just go ahead and ban Steve and be rid of his villany once and for all?

Just want to say I love all of you guys and am thankful for the admin team and community.

 

 

 

But with all that said, can we just go ahead and ban Steve and be rid of his villany once and for all?

 

good. Your bringing up the real issues.

Nah you're talking about preventing things, but that's already fine. You cant do more than to do your best and an all-seeing ref should already be enough.

I have more problems with what's being done repressively. To the things that come after a year, which are new facts to me. It's not an easy task to be an admin on this community. I think everyone knows that. I just want to give you an advice how I think you can make it easier to have more control to the community.

G Force, I don't understand how it's so out of line to discuss something that happened months ago if the general community was just made aware of what actually happened back then only a few days ago. It's not like I'm sitting here talking about Louis going rogue, or shogo leaking screens every other second, or you and nin sharing parks ahead of the match deadline, or any of the other cheating events that everyone knew about 12 months ago. I've brought up something that Camcorder showed us all on Discord a few days ago, which was an admission that the Replacements were skirting builder rules from day 1. Yeah, there's absolutely nothing to do about it now since the contest is over, but you can't try to prevent this from happening in the future if you aren't aware of it happening in the past.

As for your second point, multiple people stated (including myself) that we appreciate the work the admins and everyone else puts into the site. I know it's difficult to hear complaints about stuff when you've worked hard on something. Do you think the community brings up issues just to piss you off and make you feel like crap? We complain about these issues because we want to make the site and future contests better and fairer. Yeah, it might upset you now, but the goal is to make the staff team aware of issues so they can do something about them. Hopefully, the admins can look back at some of these threads when H2H9 rolls around and come up with some ways to avoid cheating in the future.

 

The reason I responded the way I did was because of two things.

1. Its been almost a year since the contest, there is nothing to be done about it, we tried our best to make the contest fair but obviously it's impossible to do so. We all worked hard to make the contest possible and seeing people bitch about it still for days on end, especially when it's stuff we cannot control is annoying and frustrating. Especially, like I said, considering the time that has passed. If it was two weeks later, sure I'd understand, but it's been damn near 12 months and considering that people should be able to get over what happened knowing that nothing can be done to change it.

 

I don't think anyone's asking for changes being made retroactively to H2H8. It's upsetting to many that this happened, but there's nothing to be done to change the past. That something happened, however, should not be swept under a rug, no matter how long ago it happened, because open discourse is the only way to adapt and learn from what went wrong before. Shutting down conversation on a topic just because it's old or in the past isn't healthy for this community. 

And for many, this issue isn't in the past. I'm sure the vast majority of this site believes there will be another H2H, and those affected by these events will want to know something's going to happen then to help reduce or prevent further issues.

 

 

2. Kind of elaborating on the first point but, I'm just sick of all the complaining and bitching that happens on the site with regards to how things were run or handled. It's no fun to come on here or discord and just see people complaining. The admins (not including me), and our referees all do/did a good job to try to make this site work and put a lot of honest time and effort into it. Especially when it comes to a contest like this where they're all both trying to run the contest and manage a team on top of that. Sure it's not perfect, but it's a fucking fan site for a 20 year old game. It's not mean to be taken so seriously that people get so upset about things that happened years in the past.

 

 

I don't think anyone here can or is blaming the admins for mishandling these events. Nobody knew about it except the people involved and Trav, apparently. I think we all understand that you can't act upon something that you don't know is happening. However, people do want to know that something's going to be done to help with issues like this in the future. Shutting down the conversation sends a message like "I don't want to talk about this, so It's ok for now" where the community wants to see a message like "We recognize that bad things happened and disrupted this contest, and are working on solutions to help make future contests run more smoothly"

 

It's a game, it should be fun, we're sorry that we couldn't stop people from skirting the rules but there are some things that are just out of our control. We'll try to do better next time, if their is one, but the contest should be fun first and foremost so giving teams the freedom to not be constantly monitored, audited and investigated by 3rd parties is probably something we want to keep.

There's an argument being presented on discord that I'm not sure if has been mentioned here: cheating isn't fun. It's a lot harder to be proud of a win you cheated for; nobody likes to lose to a cheater; and nobody wants to vote for a cheater. It's going to be very important moving forward to weigh the drawbacks and benefits of varying levels of oversight and freedom.

 

 

Ultimately a 6% share on a park isn't going to make that much of a difference. We're sorry it happened, but we need to get over this silly stuff. Most of us are in our 20s and 30s now. We all probably have better things to do than worry about stupid little RCT contests that happened in the past. 

I think very few people are worried about what happened and are focused on what will happen. The past needs to be recognized and learned from in order to not be repeated.

These are the comments that initially ticked me off, nothing constructive, and seemingly more upset about the past than trying to improve the future.

 

So essentially, it appears to me that all the behind the scenes cheating is coming out now. I don’t recall 6 builders being permitted in round robin...

Why did we have rules if half the teams were just breaking them anyway?

 

 

Oh look, it's another set of builder shares altered after the fact!

 

 

Seriously, how old are you guys? I didn't know personal profit was more important than fair play on this site. Selfish wankers.

 

 

I'm sorry if nothing harsh was meant and this was intended to be constructive, but it didn't come off that way to me, it came off like complaining and trying to drag up stuff that happened a while ago to me.

 

Like I said, we'll try to do a better job in the future, but some things we just can't control.  People are smart enough to share their parks via means we can't control, its been this way for ages and with discord its just made it even worse because everyone is on the same platform.  It's just not possible to moderate these things, only thing we can do is hope people play fair and respect the rules.  If rule breaking is discovered during the contest then obviously there will be penalties, but after the fact there's really not much we can do.      

He quit because of you shogo from what I heard.

his reason was "there was no project going on that he liked to work on". 

here's the tea with h2h. it's basically the reason, i believe, new element exists at this point. 2/3rds of the community does not finish anything outside of contests;

This already is utter nonsense. Saying that the 5 or 6 people that only came back for H2H last year is 2/3 of the (ever growing) community is such a huge fuck you to the other 100 or so players that keep sending stuff in. By far the largest percentage of submissions past years have been outside of contests and even if it werent there are other contests than H2H.

Whether or not you think those other submissions or players are good enough to be recognised as actual submissions is a different discussion. But dont use fake sentiments to try and argue that H2H is all that is left of NE.

fuck the rules if it meant getting in the way of my team having the best park possible. i'm not doing it to compete with the other teams; i dont care about the other teams. h2h is to me a way to work with people and showcase the 5-7 best parks you can show off, not about competing with other people to win a fucking popularity contest based around what the "community" perceives as better.

Of this is/was your opinion, what the fuck made you even consider joining H2H?!

Just stay away from contests and find a team to make a few cool parks with (probably failing at it because you are fucking impossible to work with.)

This already is utter nonsense. Saying that the 5 or 6 people that only came back for H2H last year is 2/3 of the (ever growing) community is such a huge fuck you to the other 100 or so players that keep sending stuff in. By far the largest percentage of submissions past years have been outside of contests and even if it werent there are other contests than H2H.

Whether or not you think those other submissions or players are good enough to be recognised as actual submissions is a different discussion. But dont use fake sentiments to try and argue that H2H is all that is left of NE.

 

only 29 of 66 h2h8 players had a finished release between h2h7 and h2h8

43%

Of this is/was your opinion, what the fuck made you even consider joining H2H?!

Just stay away from contests and find a team to make a few cool parks with (probably failing at it because you are fucking impossible to work with.)

 

because h2h is such an important event that only happens once every three years, and is generally the only way to get people to not only build co-op but to have the motivation to finish. 

 first of all, you have to "parkify" EVERYTHING even when it makes literally zero fucking sense. zezura? really nice worldbuilding right? they *had* to shoehorn a fucking rollercoaster and some realistic flat rides in so that half of this community (you're damn right i'm being fucking condescending right now) would vote for it. even if it kills the worldbuilding, doesn't matter. must have rides because *that's what people expect*

4. can we retire h2h as a contest format please

- The coaster was the first thing on the map, its called rollercoaster tycoon after all.

- as for your point 4: I think the better idea would be to retire H2H as a contest format you would ever have a chance of joining again. Everybody happy.

i like h2h

- as for your point 4: I think the better idea would be to retire H2H as a contest format you would ever have a chance of joining again. Everybody happy.

This is the exact sort of response we expect from you "do gooders" of NE. 

I'll keep this brief, but Bubbsy, myself, and co. merely updated the builder lists to keep percentages accurate to their true values, and waited nearly a year to do so because we thought this community would be mature enough to handle the world-shattering news that not all things are as clean and crisp as people sometimes believe. We were wrong, as it seems that the community still cannot handle the fact that a team's actions (that did not and would not have altered the contest results in any way) were not as truthful as they should have been. 

For week one, Bubbsy and myself were building the park together until issues in later weeks appeared and we shuffled our schedule. At this point, I was already the majority builder on the project and Austin55 took Bubbsy's spot. Construction commenced, we removed Bubbsy's architecture, finished the park, and later realized there was still a building and a half (along with some chairlift supports) that were actually leftover from Bubbsy. The exact buildings were the chairlift station (entrance side) and the beginnings of the obstacle course bit. I had rebuilt half of the chairlift station and queue over time, and Austin had completed the course. Things get messy when builders are swapped around and stuff is rebuilt over and over. It happens, it's the creative process. Austin and I rebuilt so much of that park as it went on that things get looked over. It happens with every park. We lost the round. But hey cheaters. Get over it.

After the theatrics of the rest of Round Robin, us Replacements were pretty beat and didn't care to continue with the contest. We built a lot of cool stuff, the community liked the other stuff more. Half of our team wasn't showing up resulting in the other half picking up the pace, filling in the gaps. We went into Week 5 having already decided that we were going to lose, having already been leaked a screen from the opposing park. Things were chaotic as no one was building much, Bubbsy couldn't get much help, until finally Leon and I decided to help Bubbsy finish it, just to have a complete roster of parks for RR. I know, bad on us. Trav and Louis privately told us that they were planning the same though, to drop from the contest and give us the win, and that fucked everything up moving forward as we *literally did not have a semis park*, and were to lose the next round anyway. That's not an excuse by any means, but given the situation we decided to keep quiet on the subject until now, as it seemed like any \other sort of drama was going to implode the site at the time.

-


So here we are, now, nearly a year later getting personal attacks from people, getting kicked and leaving the community discord, and writing novels for a select few that will actually read them. I've had a lot of pent up anger and frustration with this community for months now and it's consistently gotten worse over time as I've learned the true nature of many of you. You can be toxic, cruel, and so many single out the weaker individuals here until they disappear thanks to you trolls. That said, I've met and befriended so many of you over the years that I can't help but be thankful. The H2H8 Replacements will always mean something to me and so many have become some of my best friends. I hope and wish many of you on this site can say the same about your RCT colleagues that you spend so much time with. It's been a great 12 year ride for me, but my time with this site and community is up. I wish you guys the best. 

We went into Week 5 having already decided that we were going to lose, having already been leaked a screen from the opposing park.

Wait what? This is actually news to me. Who leaked the screens?