RCT Discussion / OpenRCT: advantages and disadvantages

- Changing ride ratings
- Open/close park
- Remove border fence
- Own all land
- Add cash (more than 5000)
- Changing staff skins
- Add custom message
- Remove all messages
- Save/load landscape as BMP (or PNG, I don't care)
- Making rides reliable without resetting the ride's age
- Adjusting the date
- Counting map data
- 8cars-style zero clearances
- Disasters (from Son of Beast trainer)
- Map Object Manipulation (something that's not as manual as codex, raising things tile by tile... The power of MOM is being able to change lots of shit with a few simple clicks)

Gymnasiast, you're saying changing the track type is included in OpenRCT? Where can I find it? Otherwise, this should be on my list

Changing track type is possible using the console. The command to use is 'rides'.

 

 

With open/close park I assume you mean forcibly (i.e. when not normally possible)? That's a feature we could add to sandbox mode.

 

Owning all land is possible: just put the game in sandbox mode and open the map window to edit ownership. This now also works for the map edges.

Adding a custom message seems to be in the code, but has no frontend.

 

With 'Counting map data', do you mean counting what's in the "landscape data area"? And am I right in assuming it's to see how much objects you can still place?

 

What can 8 cars-style zero clearances do what ours can't? To me it seems 8 cars used that approach because it had no other way.

 

Disasters: really? We have spontaneous combustion though, since a developer thought it was a nice feature.

 

As for MOM: I think that adding raise/lower support to the tile inspector and making it possible to select multiple tiles at once (a bit like how you select big area of land) catches about 99% of use cases.

Via the console? Not very accessible if you're not a computer geek. Every time I accidentally open the console I'm getting a headache.

 

Yes, the map data thing counts the number of objects on the map and tells you how much you still have left to use. See the comments under the 'FUCK' screen that is currently on the front page of the site.

 

The new zero clearance thing is a nightmare if you have to stack things. And building structures underwater is a hideous task too. Also, OpenRCT-zero-clearanced path removes walls, as do stalls and ride huts if I remember correctly. Sometimes, the original zero-clearance is more useful.

 

Disasters: riot can be useful, although that gets covered by a vandalise park thing too, I think X723952948 discussed that a few pages ago, or somewhere else? I've used Epidemic in the past too.

 

MOM: if you add a selector like that, I think you're right. Be sure to include every type of 'things', because everything has a purpose: land, water, path, large scenery, small scenery, walls, rides, everything.

Out of your list, the following features are already in OpenRCT2:

• You can open and close the park using the command "set park_open <0/1>"
• You can own all land by enabling sandbox mode, and using the land tool in the minimap (where it is in the scenario editor)
• You can remove the border fence by owning the tiles on the edge of the map
• You can add (or remove) money using the command "set money <amount>". You can also toggle money on/off with "set no_money <0/1>"
• You can change track types with "rides set type <ride number> <track type>". To see a list of rides and their number, use "rides list". Sadly, there doesn't appear to be a way to get a list of available track types - but it is worth remembering that crooked house is 47 and twister is 51. Also, junior is 4, which is worth knowing since this is currently the only way to take advantage of the new steep slopes (other than RCT1 import)

The issues you mention with the zero clearance can probably be fixed without switching back to 8Car's method - I expect they haven't quite caught everywhere where the clearances are checked yet. I can confirm that stacking doesn't work, building paths can remove walls, it won't let you build underwater (but you can raise water through existing objects), and paths often fail to connect or leave ghost objects on the map.

Map object manipulation is still missing. I think the best way to implement it is to a) extend the tile inspector to allow selecting an area instead of just 1 tile, and b) implementing a filter so that you can filter the list of displayed map elemetns by type and possibly other parameters like associated ride.

Via the console? Not very accessible if you're not a computer geek. Every time I accidentally open the console I'm getting a headache.

 

You want to perform hacks that are not explicitly supported, modify internal game data and will probably be changed in future, but don't really want to do it? Sorry, but you can only choose one option. We will most probably not add any other interface to that.

Freezing staff is another thing that is not included in ORCT I think. It would be awesome if you could freeze individual staff members on their own and not like in 8cars all at once.

Freezing staff is another thing that is not included in ORCT I think. It would be awesome if you could freeze individual staff members on their own and not like in 8cars all at once.

 

https://github.com/O...CT2/issues/3472

 

What's the benefit of freezing staff?

You can place them as "theming objects".

 

 

 

https://github.com/O...CT2/issues/3472

 

What's the benefit of freezing staff?

 

The benefit is you can use staff as extra details in the park, like a living statue or something for example. You can name it so it's clear what it is. Something you can't with just an object.  

You want to perform hacks that are not explicitly supported, modify internal game data and will probably be changed in future, but don't really want to do it? Sorry, but you can only choose one option. We will most probably not add any other interface to that.

I don't see why you can't add those things to the interface, while you guys are constantly adding functions... What's the difference?

Also, it's a bit frustrating to have you question every suggestion here. Fifteen years of hacking and parkmaking history extends beyond your imagination, or any other individual for that matter. If you don't see a use for something, doesn't mean there's no use at all.

You want to perform hacks that are not explicitly supported, modify internal game data and will probably be changed in future, but don't really want to do it? Sorry, but you can only choose one option. We will most probably not add any other interface to that.

I think you may be taking Liam's post the wrong way. I share his opinion with the command. I think it is very second nature for anyone used to working in that atmosphere. You do have to remember though that a very small percentage of the folks on NE have any form of programming or advanced computer knowledge. None of us are "hackers" by trade. The only reason 95% of those still playing this game are able to use hacking and modifications to the games code is that through the SoB and 8 Cars trainers, we were given hacking abilities through an interface that was so simple that I never felt like I was hacking a game- I was just using a tool.

I think the interface and the ease of use needs to stay as simple as possible, having the command as an option for those who either get more of a thrill from the sheer fact that they're modifying a programs internal memory or are comfortable and familiar with that style of program is fine, but for the 99% of us that would rather there was a way to accomplish a task without opening it up, it'd be nice to have a more user friendly interface.

Remember, we aren't hackers, we are just nerds using an outdated game as a 3 dimensional modeling tool (often for things beyond theme park related) and just want these additional tools to be as user friendly as a trainer is.

I don't think typing a few words and pressing return is really that difficult. Most console commands modify specific values in memory - and there's literally hundreds of variables you might want to modify (only a fraction of which are currently accessible). A page full of buttons for every single one is rather clunky, and you'll spend more time looking for the one you want than you would typing the command.

I don't even know what commands I can use, or how I have to write those commands. Then I'd rather search for a button on a page full of buttons  I agree with Liampie and Disneylandian. Adding just a button is way more simple and more accessible. I'm not a programmer.  

Also, it's a bit frustrating to have you question every suggestion here. Fifteen years of hacking and parkmaking history extends beyond your imagination, or any other individual for that matter. If you don't see a use for something, doesn't mean there's no use at all.

Beyond my imagination? I find that quite an arrogant statement, to be honest. I also can't help but notice you have very vocal opinions about what OpenRCT2 lacks, but still listed a few things that were already implemented.

 

As for the reason I question everything: we don't aim to replicate what 8 cars, Son of Beast and other tools do, we aim to support what you want to achieve with it - put simply: what you do with it, not how. Zero clearance is an example: when I asked why you wanted 8 cars style zero clearance, you listed some drawbacks about OpenRCT2's version. All of those are paper cuts and not inherent to our approach. So we're better off addressing those bugs than adding another way of doing zero clearance - one that actually has inherent drawbacks, such as having a much higher risk of corrupting map elements.

Finally (to everyone): we would appreciate it if bugs like autoremoving walls when in zero clearance mode were reported to our issue tracker, rather than us having to look through several topics. Or even better: get involved directly, our code is open source and pull requests are welcomed. We can use the extra manpower. X7123M3-256 already paved the way with his excellent long train cheat.

To second what Gymnasiast said: we only provided a way to change the ride type via console, because it is a hack and will most likely eventually get changed. I don't see us providing any other UI for that. Given how it is likely to crash the game, I was reluctant to add even that, but your arguments swayed me in favour.

 

Your intention is to hide a ride, not change its type and when we're ready we'll provide an easy way to make a ride invisible, probably by a checkbox or some other option that will make sense given possibilities.

Beyond my imagination? I find that quite an arrogant statement, to be honest. I also can't help but notice you have very vocal opinions about what OpenRCT2 lacks, but still listed a few things that were already implemented.

 

Yes, it sounds dickish. But it's just exhausting to have you or someone else respond with "why would you want to do that?" when if you were familiar with the existing community you would know that those things are commonly used.

 

The reason why I'm so vocal is because I'm worried about the compatibility with the traditional RCT parks as well as methods. I think it would be sad if we got dependant on OpenRCT, which seems to be the current prospect, and being rendered unable to things we were able to do before. It's in my interest to preserve this, and I know I'm speaking for others as well.

 

I would contribute if I had any knowledge of coding and stuff at all. I guess working with the console will have to do, but a tutorial (a list of commands and how to use them - without using any words your grandmother wouldn't understand) would be welcome.

Yes, it sounds dickish. But it's just exhausting to have you or someone else respond with "why would you want to do that?" when if you were familiar with the existing community you would know that those things are commonly used.

Since I'm not familiar with the existing community I have to fully understand how every feature and hack is used in order to properly implement it. That might be a bit tedious, but it's necessary unfortunately.

 

I would contribute if I had any knowledge of coding and stuff at all. I guess working with the console will have to do, but a tutorial (a list of commands and how to use them - without using any words your grandmother wouldn't understand) would be welcome.

I would be the first to admit the documentation is lacking. We can use more manpower in general, but since we don't have it, we're mostly concentrating on the development itself.

 

 

By the way, if any of you want to improve the documentation: feel free to add it to the wiki.

Since I'm not familiar with the existing community I have to fully understand how every feature and hack is used in order to properly implement it. That might be a bit tedious, but it's necessary unfortunately.

 

Does it help if someone told you that freezing staff is used to create a man fishing in a canoe? Serious question, because how that would help is something beyond my own imagination.

 

 

Does it help if someone told you that freezing staff is used to create a man fishing in a canoe? Serious question, because how that would help is something beyond my own imagination.

Well, that's very specific, but mentioning that freezing staff is used to have them serve as scenery does help, yes.

It actually does help us.

 

It lets us know what kind of effects you usually want to achieve and we will surely take such cases into consideration when we are up to designing our own format and feature sets we will try to support.

 

Not all cases are equally important and this may not be so obvious to you, but keep in mind we have our own programmers' imaginations