General Chat / SOPA Topic

So why isn't pirate bay inaccessible in the US? The internet is my life as a web entrepreneur, but I am not worried by this at all, just because it's so absurd. It's just unenforceable on the scale that people express concerns on.

New Element's going to be shut down because I have a Noah and the Whale avatar, for instance? Zero chance, absolutely zero. Why would a music band or other entity pay for the huge legal fees it costs to shut a site down (again, how much money has been thrown at shutting down the pirate bay - again, it's still up) just because one of us is using their copyrighted image as an avatar? Would infogrames have a financial interest in shutting this site down because we are posting RCT screenshots that technically they own the copyright to? The same applies not only to New Element but other sites across the web - I'm just using it as an example.

If the USA start policing .com domains with this attitude by forcing verisign to act in a certain way, I think there would be global outrage. Many localised businesses have .coms - businesses that don't trade in the USA at all. I don't think you're correct in saying that such a domain would fall under American jurisdiction. Let's say I have a local business here in London called "deanoinlondon.com" and I breach a copyright of another British company. I find it difficult to believe that other company could use the american courts to take down my website.

I agree that the proposed law is absurd and ridiculous. But guys, calm down. There's a difference between something being technically illegal and practically enforceable and that gap is wider when the internet is concerned than with anything else.

I agree with deano

I've been reading up on this a little bit, and the things that are worrying people are absurd. The things beyond protecting piracy that this bill would stop would be things such as not being able to post lyrics to a song on facebook as a status without giving credit, and not being able to post videos of you playing a game on youtube without giving credit to the game's maker...soo what's the problem? We won't have to deal with retarded lyric statuses on facebook anymore and you have to give credit to the people who deserve it when you post a video. Sure it might be a bitch for Facebook and YouTube to create a system to censor stuff like this, but that's for them to worry about not us

I would also think that if this causes the public uproar it's supposively going to after congress potentially passes it, then it would be very unwise for Obama's upcoming 2012 campaign for him to approve of it, so he would likely make congress change the bill somewhat before he does pass it. I wouldn't start worrying yet

Again you miss the point entirely. This isn't about shutting down a site bacause someone has a copyrighted avatar or something. The point is that they can shut something down what is completely legal but unwanted because where the copyrighted avatar is the tool to do so. Have you any idea how bad the entertainment industry wanted to take early youtube down? If this law existed and was passed before they would have succeeded.

As for the pirate bay, it's also stamped illegal in Sweden as far as I know as the owners are convicted. How they are still in the air is anyone's guess. If this law ever passes though which I hope not, be sure that it's the first site that will be blocked.

^It isn't stamped illegal in Sweden, as far as I know, the judges have said, that countries may block thepiratebay whenever they want but they can't shut down the base.

To what you were saying, like the game review site. Posting a bad review won't result into a site being deleted, that's the rule of free speech. Whenever you're in court for that it'll take a lot of money for the game distributor to actually get you there and a normal judge will probably settle for an agreement rather than a complete shutdown in one of those cases, as long as the review-site isn't acting stupid in court and tell the real moral of the game distributor.

When it comes to copyright laws I think you only really need to worry if your trying to make a profit off something, or miss-representing it. I actually think NE could be slightly at risk. I believe it was Cork who said that the site had got requests to remove some logos, maybe the Disney ones.

Disney is a bitch about copyright laws. They saw article on a school with pictures of their characters in the background on a wall and requested they take them down due to a copyright violation... fucking Micky...

Tyandor, there's a principle in law that only appropriate action can be taken according to a crime.

So let's take the NE example again. The use of Disney logos. Disney's grievance would be either:
a) New Element is making money from use of copyrighted images as Kumba said (not true - so not viable, NE doesn't make any money as far as I'm aware)
or:
b) They are losing money from NE's use of the logos - difficult to prove as the logos are only used on spotlight parks so if anything NE is doing them a favour, and even if so, the numbers involved would be pathetically small

Even if this law would technically make shutting down a website for copyright infringement a viable option, Disney would have to show sufficient loss or that NE has sufficient illegal gain in order to implement something as drastic as shutting down the site - which would be a disproportionate action.

See how that's a specific case for one website and each case would have to be looked at individually be professional lawyers?

By US law, and I'd imagine 100% of western laws, common theft is a crime punishable by prison. But if I grab a couple of quid off the floor of a bus, and I know who dropped it and don't give it back, I'm not going to prison. Now, if I do that 10 times with increasing numbers of money, then maybe I do.

This may alter the way the internet works in the long term, if it gets passed and doesn't face wide spread international ridicule, but to think that suddenly half of the sites on the internet are just going to be shut down, which is what some people in this thread have inferred, is absurd and ridiculous.

The Pirate Bay really does prove my point. Of course it's illegal in sweden, of course it's illegal in the US. A law already exists to enforce someone to shut that site down. Still hasn't happened though has it? The reason why is that legal matters like this are incredibly complicated, and the internet is a place where you can very easily evade court orders. Go host your site in Afghanistan! If the US starts shutting down all the .coms, welcome to global ridicule, widespread use of more localised domains and .org, and goodbye the US's hosting industry and hello Afghanistan's.

It's just not going to happen. Look at the piracy fight as an example. That hasn't been stopped yet, and Napster's release is 12 years ago now. If these things - be it pirating stuff or going against copyrights - are widespread enough, any laws like these prove to just not be enforceable.

It's a dangerous law that shouldn't be passed. But let's not go all sensationalist about it.

http://www.pcworld.c...sh_boycott.html

If anyone isn't already convinced SOPA is awful, Adam Savage of Mythbusters wrote a great, quick. and easily digestible article on it here.

I guess I can always rely on the Mythbusters to teach me things.

For all you nonbelievers...

link

Particularly the part where it says "the White House threatened to veto the bill if it had passed"
The system of checks and balances isn't as shitty as you guys seem to think it is, chill out

I just wanna say that I never really meant to argue against how right or wrong this bill was, I never really knew too much about it. It didn't seem to effect me too much because I really don't care too much about sites like youtube, facebook, etc. But I did want to argue that there is no way America would ever let something that was even remotely similar to the Chinese Firewall in its ideals come to fruition in our country

People might be interested to know Wikipedia are doing an English language black out tomorrow to protest SOPA...

But I did want to argue that there is no way America would ever let something that was even remotely similar to the Chinese Firewall in its ideals come to fruition in our country

Yeaaah..... about that... Your goverment is passing laws continueously with slowly but surely are stripping you from 'freedom' and rights. This link may be not on topic of the SOPA (clicky!), but believe me there might be a moment in the future where you are thinking; why the fuck did we allow this to happen?!?
The patriot act is also so such a 'nice' piece of legislation right? The thing is that the US is losing power on multiple fronts and it's doing lots of things to regain it.

Yeah, I don't really know, it's sort of a hard situation with that and the Patriot Act. Unfortunately it's a tough time to be a suspicious terrorist, or even just a Muslim living in the United States...seriously. But in defense of those bills, the United States has been pretty safe since 2001 and they don't have too negative of an effect on too many people. Like you said tho, that's pretty different than the Firewall in China

Looks like some major sites are having a internet blackout today to protest SOPA and PIPA. My college profs must be overjoyed about a day with no Wikipedia... good thing I knew to leave my browser untouched with all the needed pages for my research paper open

any legislation congrASS passes, just read the name of the bill, and it's basically the exact opposite of the title.

The whole american lobby-system with congress and senators is solely based on one thing; making money. I think its wrong. what about the environment, how human are threated, and in this case, privacy. I think its about time some revolution will happen there, just to change it for the better for everyone.

But ofcourse, this is only my opinion. SOPA, Pipa, and ACTA, should all go to the graveyard if you ask me.

^ I agree. It is a pathetic system. I would love a system without any corporate influence. Unfortunately, it seems Washington is stuck in a rut, and the Democrat and Republican drones will always just do what they're told.

Wow... this is rich... it'll make you laugh... or maybe make you mad hah. Either way, it's worth a glance.

http://twitpic.com/88ueqz

^ I remember your last stab at gaining attention. Fail #2 here?

Build something and show it to us or shut the fuck up.

I think you have your sites mixed up.

^^seen that pic before but it made me lol so much