Screenshot / Initial test of my RMC train
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21-September 15
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I agree that these trains look a bit too small, but I have very little data on the size, so I have to go with what I've got. Unless I find some actual measurements to suggest it should be larger, I'm not going to change it. Sorry.
As soon as I have a picture of what it looks like on the correct track, I'll post it here, but I'm still working on the renderer atm. I've just got a single flat track piece rendered right now.
I'm curious to hear about this track project and how you're doing it, as it has always been thought to be impossible to make a new track in the game.
I doubt OpenRCT2 has reverse engineered enough code to implement true custom track styles yet, and it's probably going to be a very large task even when it is possible. The other think to look into is whether it's possible to add additional, but still hardcoded track styles to the game. I don't think either option is possible just yet, but I intend to look into it, as the games track styles are very limited. Twister track is pretty much the only one that isn't missing pieces. In the meantime, the preview image for this coaster is going to have to be on the right track, because it looks awful on both wooden and twister track.
I would say go ahead and release two versions, that way everyone's happy. But either way, these trains are awesome.
Why does this data matter? Why does the ride need to be exactly to scale? You're porting it into a 2d isometric game; nothing's going to be perfect about it, nobody's going to be able to create flawless recreations, and nobody's going to complain about minutiae like the train being a few inches wider than the irl version, so long as it looks good.
I can see that you might have some academic interest in keeping things to the real size, but ultimately, this is for a game, so making it fit the game makes more sense to me than making it fit reality.
That said, this is completely your own project, everyone on this site appreciates what you're doing to transform this game, and the cars will be loved regardless of what you end up choosing to do with regards to scale.
The game's existing rides are to scale; many of the trains I've checked are within a pixel or two of the width I calculated for them, and that can be accounted for by rounding error. The only sprite I've found so far that is definitely not to scale is the peeps (and it's really, really annoying because they won't fit in my rides, but peeps that don't match the in game ones look worse than peeps that aren't to scale.). If there weren't a clear scale to work from, I probably wouldn't have started this project in the first place.
Like I said, if you want a larger version just tell my how much you want it scaled up and I'll do it for you, but I'm keeping my primary version to scale because anything else would be unrealistic. I don't really want to cause an argument, but I can't see why I can't just release two versions if there's disagreement on how large they should be.
I consider it more important to make the trains match the real thing than the game, because anything in the game that doesn't match reality is on my list of stuff I hope to change eventually. I've always done this: the dive machine models don't match the game's track either and nobody complained then.
You think it wouldn't be noticeable, but this isn't a few inches difference, the trains would have to be at least 10% larger to get them to match that wooden track, and then they just look off when compared to other trains in the game. If I were prepared to ignore accuracy I'd just port rides across from RCT3 - that would be much faster, but some of those models are just awful.
Really, I think the real cause of this problem is that the game's track is too wide. I don't really have a solution; if I'd known the track didn't match before I started I wouldn't have chosen to do this train; this is exactly why I don't do rides that don't have a matching track style. This problem hasn't shown up before because I was careful not to do rides that wouldn't fit with the game. When I started the RMC models, I didn't fully understand the differences between Topper track and traditional track, and I assumed that since Topper track is considered wooden, the wooden track would be a good match, but this is not the case. However, I've got the models now so I might as well release it.
Also I've remeasured the game's PTC train. The seats are 18 pixels wide; 1 pixel wider than my RMC train. The base of the PTC trains is somewhat wider than that; but checking with some photos of real PTC trains shows that the actual wheel assembly lies exactly where it is on the RMC - the wider base appears to be structural. Therefore, it seems likely that both the game's PTC trains and my RMC trains do have the correct scale. The game's track, I believe, is the cause of the mismatch but there's nothing I can do about it.
Oooh! I like this very much! I agree with ITM statement, this is just a game and I'm sure the designer did not scale the rides exactly 100% to scale down to the inch. They most likely compromised on the scale and the game scale and picked the middle for the visual effect. 99.99% of the people playing this game wouldn't even notice its 2 inches off beside the person who created it, all they would notice is that the visual scale is off. I would prefer it to match the visual scale than the actual scale, but that's just my preference, I play the game for the visuals and not to have everything absolutely 100% to scale and realistic.
I'll release the scaled up version for those who prefer the oversized trains. I myself will stick with the normal ones. I'll have to sort out the peeps though - that screenshot was taken by simply modifying the projection matrix and reexporting the ride, but this affects the peeps as well - they definitely should not be scaled up.
Would people prefer it if the two versions were released with the same name and checksum (so that if you open a park that was made with the other version, you see the version that you have installed), or with distinct names (so that you can have both installed at once)?
I mean visual scale by that "it looks right in game" rather than "the accurate scale."
But I'm glad to hear you'll be releasing both version, I look forward to it! Keep up the great work you been doing so far! The whole community is appreciative of everything you done so far!
So as far as I'm concerned, what looks right in the game is the accurate scale, which is the only scale used anywhere. I think the problem is that peopme are comparing it to the B&M track it runs on in my screenshots - but that's wider than RMC track, so you shouldn't expect them to match. That's why I posted a picture of it on mine train track - IMO it stops looking too small when it's on the right size track. I'd almost be prepared to release it on mine train track for that reason, but mine train track is missing too many elements.
If you want I can see what the scaled up trains look like on mine train track - I bet they'd look too large then. The scaled up version just looks off when compared to other trains of similar size in game - and measurements confirm this. Honestly I'm sure the issue is with the track it's on being the wrong type, but people don't seem to agree. Today I got a crude track renderer working; tomorrow I begin the process of determining the geometry of every piece in the game. Before this ride is released I'll have screenshots of it on IBox track, and then you can decide if the scale is right.
But I said I'd release a larger version, so I will. I'm not happy about it, and I hope it doesn't become a de facto standard, but it seems the majority of people on here would rather have it match the B&M track than the track it's supposed to run on. At least I now know that I shouldn't attempt rides if I don't have an exact match for the track. Really, I should never have chosen this train in the first place because with no close match in the game, you basically can't make it look good no matter what you do.
The game allows 3 track styles. Why not one on Wooden, one on B&M, and one on Mine Train?
The smaller version is actually the right size, RMC trains are smaller than other wooden trains I've seen. It just looks weird with all those heads so close together. I think some extra spacing between the cars is all it would really need to look good, regardless of scale. It could also be a factor of the lift being completely horizontal in pixel-space. I think that might be a bad angle for the cars to be viewed at, as I think the lower car twisting through the banks down there looks a lot better than the car on the lift.
There's very little seperation between cars - I think at the moment it's set at 5cm, which is basically nothing in game, but I'm not as averse to increasing the spacing as I am to changing the scale. I'll look into it.
If you want I'll upload the save tomorrow so you can see it in game. I can also upload more screenshots if desired.